Migrating DTB reviews to the ATB

[AnimalToyForum]

Let's put together a list of individual Dinosaur Toy Blog reviews that should be migrated to the Animal Toy Blog. To do this, let's also formally agree on a new simple definition for which animals go in which blog.

The current definition seems to be:
Extinct = Dinosaur Toy Blog
Extant = Animal Toy Blog

But this should probably become:
Prehistoric = Dinosaur Toy Blog
Historic/Recent = Animal Toy Blog

If we adopt this new definition, are there any animals that might straddle the boundary?

[Halichoeres]

"Prehistoric" is a little bit fuzzy, can I propose a cutoff of AD 1500 for last observation? There would be very few ambiguous cases, but it would still pull all of the Yowie Forgotten Friends, ivory-billed woodpeckers, gombessas, thylacines, etc. over to the ATB.

[AnimalToyForum]

Sure, it makes sense to settle on a cut-off date. That cut-off date (1500) would also move dodo reviews to the ATB, but not moa reviews (extinct around 1445). Is that okay with everyone? Or should we push the cut-off a bit further back.

Here's an excellent reference for this discussion: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_extinctions_in_the_Holocene

[bmathison1972]

What's frustrating is that I feel we have already had this discussion before, yet some people continue to post recently extinct things on DTB.

I am OK with a time cut-off; I'd probably take it back a little further but am Ok with consensus.

If we start migrating over, I'd suggest no more than 1-2 a week, as as not to compete with 'new' reviews. Adam, we also need to get back to migrating over ATF walkarounds; I should try to do one a week...

[AnimalToyForum]

What's frustrating is that I feel we have already had this discussion before, yet some people continue to post recently extinct things on DTB.

I am OK with a time cut-off; I'd probably take it back a little further but am Ok with consensus.

If we start migrating over, I'd suggest no more than 1-2 a week, as as not to compete with 'new' reviews. Adam, we also need to get back to migrating over ATF walkarounds; I should try to do one a week...

Yeah, it was the recent publication of the Yowie slender bush wren that prompted me to make some headway on this. http://dinotoyblog.com/2022/05/22/slender-bush-wren-forgotten-friends-series-a-by-yowie/

I was actually planning to use a Wordpress migrate tool to migrate all of them in bulk. This might even migrate the publication dates as well so the reviews won't all gather at the top of the blog, but I'm not sure as I haven't used the export-import function before.

[suspsy]

If this is to be done, then I propose the cutoff date be something like 1000 AD just to be truly safe. After all, moas were alive and well in NZ back when King Richard I and Saladin were battling over Jerusalem, but I don't think anyone considers that time to be have been truly "ancient."

And damnation, this means that I will now be short four reviews in order to bring my count to 250 come September as I have been planning. Perhaps I shall simply post four of my "reserve" batch to make up for the loss.

[Halichoeres]

I'm not married to 1500 in particular, but it's a common cutoff in extinction literature because European colonial expansion set off a materially different tempo of extinctions (see e.g., https://royalsociety.org/topics-policy/projects/biodiversity/decline-and-extinction/). The beginning of the Holocene seems too far back because then mammoths and the like get pushed to the recent. I think the main difference between 1000 and 1500 would be extinctions in NZ, Madagascar, and Hawaii associated with Polynesian/Austronesian expansion.

[stargatedalek]

I'm in favour of not being strict about this.

Recently extinct animals are thematically relevant to both so I think they belong on both blogs. Same as examples like the Invicta blue whale which are part of dinosaur centric lines.

If there has to be a cutoff, I don't think date is the best way of handling it. I would make it whether the animals appearance is fully known from colour photographs or mounts, or whether it's appearance has a degree of speculation to it.

[bmathison1972]

I'm not married to 1500 in particular, but it's a common cutoff in extinction literature because European colonial expansion set off a materially different tempo of extinctions (see e.g., https://royalsociety.org/topics-policy/projects/biodiversity/decline-and-extinction/). The beginning of the Holocene seems too far back because then mammoths and the like get pushed to the recent. I think the main difference between 1000 and 1500 would be extinctions in NZ, Madagascar, and Hawaii associated with Polynesian/Austronesian expansion.

I like 1000 AD

[BlueKrono]

I also vote 1000 AD.

[EpicRaptorMan]

Why not have 3 criteria? We can decide a wiggle period of when the organism went extinct and submit them to both forums. Even that will cause confusion. For example, the dodo went extinct in 1681 yet it's still portrayed as prehistoric in the media.

Prehistoric: DTB
Modern Era: ATB
1500-1000AD: Both

[GojiraGuy1954]

The current system is fine. With the new proposal all of the Woolly Mammoth reviews would be in the criteria for movement

[bmathison1972]

The current system is fine. With the new proposal all of the Woolly Mammoth reviews would be in the criteria for movement

No, not if the cut-off was 1000 AD (and I also want mammoths to stay on DTB)

[Gwangi]

Sometimes you just gotta follow your instincts. Mammoths obviously belong on the DTB. A case could be made for Moa on either blog but I would say the ATB for them. I only have one review that would need transferring, the Mojo thylacine.

[suspsy]

All my reviews of recently extinct animals—CollectA ivory-billed woodpecker, CollectA thylacine, Mojo Fun quagga, and Southlands Replicas thylacine—were transferred over here a long time ago.

[Halichoeres]

Why not have 3 criteria? We can decide a wiggle period of when the organism went extinct and submit them to both forums. Even that will cause confusion. For example, the dodo went extinct in 1681 yet it's still portrayed as prehistoric in the media.

Prehistoric: DTB
Modern Era: ATB
1500-1000AD: Both

You know, I could live with that.

Tangentially related, I suppose I should also be using CE rather than AD.

[AnimalToyForum]

All my reviews of recently extinct animals—CollectA ivory-billed woodpecker, CollectA thylacine, Mojo Fun quagga, and Southlands Replicas thylacine—were transferred over here a long time ago.

Thanks for the reminder, I need to make sure not to migrate them again then.

[AnimalToyForum]

Why not have 3 criteria? We can decide a wiggle period of when the organism went extinct and submit them to both forums. Even that will cause confusion. For example, the dodo went extinct in 1681 yet it's still portrayed as prehistoric in the media.

Prehistoric: DTB
Modern Era: ATB
1500-1000AD: Both

You know, I could live with that.

Tangentially related, I suppose I should also be using CE rather than AD.

The simpler the better I think. So, let's settle on the 1000CE cut-off. Now we just need a list of all the posts that need to be migrated...

[suspsy]

AFAIK, these are all the Recently Extinct DTB reviews. I don't think there are any that weren't tagged with that category. As I said above, mine are already on the ATB.

http://dinotoyblog.com/category/recently-extinct/

When will the migration commence then?

[stargatedalek]

Why not have 3 criteria? We can decide a wiggle period of when the organism went extinct and submit them to both forums. Even that will cause confusion. For example, the dodo went extinct in 1681 yet it's still portrayed as prehistoric in the media.

Prehistoric: DTB
Modern Era: ATB
1500-1000AD: Both

You know, I could live with that.

Tangentially related, I suppose I should also be using CE rather than AD.

The simpler the better I think. So, let's settle on the 1000CE cut-off. Now we just need a list of all the posts that need to be migrated...

The simplest option though is to just not have a strict rule about this. They are relevant to both, so why not place them on both as submitted?

I get not wanting mammoths on the ATB, or Baiji on the DTB, but in trying to find a technical cutoff point we're avoiding talking about the actual reason this distinction is wanted to begin with. It's (I hope) not wanted only because people need one more thing to get semantic about in their lives, but because some extinct species better fit the intentions of one blog over the other.